<html xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:m="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40"><head><meta http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=utf-8"><meta name=Generator content="Microsoft Word 15 (filtered medium)"><style><!--
/* Font Definitions */
@font-face
{font-family:"Cambria Math";
panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Calibri;
panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}
/* Style Definitions */
p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
{margin:0cm;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
font-size:11.0pt;
font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;}
a:link, span.MsoHyperlink
{mso-style-priority:99;
color:blue;
text-decoration:underline;}
a:visited, span.MsoHyperlinkFollowed
{mso-style-priority:99;
color:#954F72;
text-decoration:underline;}
.MsoChpDefault
{mso-style-type:export-only;}
@page WordSection1
{size:612.0pt 792.0pt;
margin:70.85pt 3.0cm 70.85pt 3.0cm;}
div.WordSection1
{page:WordSection1;}
--></style></head><body lang=ES link=blue vlink="#954F72"><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal>Dear all,</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Sorry for late response. Thanks a lot for all your comments. Regarding the comment from Carl Johnson, I think that Ruud Loeffen has already answered with my point of view. I agree it is related to the nucleus, but it appears also in the orbit of the electron in different ways (relation of distances, velocities…). So it can be an approach to go (good or wrong) to be checked.</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>And regarding the email from Tuffail Abbas. I answer with my comments.</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Mathematical Approach: <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#002060'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal>TA: In my opinion , Quadratic Equations are too simplistic to accurately represent the physical reality. Possibly quadratic equation could represent some approximation , where higher order terms of a binomial expansion have negligible contribution. However, I don't know how this may help or apply to your case. May be the error is due to neglecting higher order terms.<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#002060'>JS: I completely agree. When using my models (see later) I always get a quartic expression (4 grade) but not with the expected roots. But normally it does appear this 1/4pi^2 coefficient that is near to alpha. Thre quadratic (2 grade) expression I have used is an ad-hoc (not based in any model) that demostrates that alpha can appear from a simple equation. But my expectation is that alpha would be the root of a quartic expression (4 grade) or higher.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Physical Approach: <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>TA: Sea gull around light house analogy is interesting. But I realized that every particle have spins, so absolute non rotating lighthouses should not exist. Infact all particles are seagull with internal (of mirror) and external (about a point outside itself) spins.<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#002060'>JS: Yes, that is exactly the point. What I have used is to consider that the particle in the center (normally the proton or nucleus) is rotating pointing in a direction that is rotating. At the sametime the seagull (the electron) makes a translation around the nucleus and an internal rotation (this mirror model). And we have to synchro that every certain time the lighthouse points the mirror (so the phtons can arrive). We can take into account also the time to a photon going form the lighthouse to the mirror (and we have a kind of shifting delay). Also we have to take into account that the mirror rotated slower due to special relativistic effect. I have tried different things. I normally get a quartic (4 grade) expression but not with the alpha result. What I have found is an ad-hoc quadratic (2 grade) expression that is near but not related to any model.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Additional Comment<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>TA: Is not alpha times c, approximately equal to velocity of sun about the Galactic centre? As the sun moves, all particles that we can measure move along.Alpha times c is also equal to velocity of electron in first Bohr orbit of hydrogen atom. <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#002060'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#002060'>I also did not know this relation. Perfectly there could be a relation if alpha is related to the inner structure of everything and appears in the end everywhere anyhow or if it is related to rotating and translating objects (whatever the size)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Enviado desde <a href="https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986">Correo</a> para Windows 10</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div style='mso-element:para-border-div;border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=MsoNormal style='border:none;padding:0cm'><b>De: </b><a href="mailto:physics-request@tuks.nl">physics-request@tuks.nl</a><br><b>Enviado: </b>miércoles, 31 de enero de 2018 12:02<br><b>Para: </b><a href="mailto:physics@tuks.nl">physics@tuks.nl</a><br><b>Asunto: </b>Physics Digest, Vol 11, Issue 4</p></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Send Physics mailing list submissions to</p><p class=MsoNormal> physics@tuks.nl</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit</p><p class=MsoNormal> http://mail.tuks.nl/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/physics</p><p class=MsoNormal>or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to</p><p class=MsoNormal> physics-request@tuks.nl</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>You can reach the person managing the list at</p><p class=MsoNormal> physics-owner@tuks.nl</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific</p><p class=MsoNormal>than "Re: Contents of Physics digest..."</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Today's Topics:</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal> 1. Re: Situation of the calculation of alpha (the fine structure</p><p class=MsoNormal> constant) (Tufail Abbas)</p><p class=MsoNormal> 2. Pari Spolter: Gravitational Force of the Sun & The Dance of</p><p class=MsoNormal> the Moon (Soretna)</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>----------------------------------------------------------------------</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Message: 1</p><p class=MsoNormal>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2018 23:12:56 +0400</p><p class=MsoNormal>From: Tufail Abbas <tufail.abbas@gmail.com></p><p class=MsoNormal>To: General Physics and Natural Philosophy discussion list</p><p class=MsoNormal> <physics@tuks.nl></p><p class=MsoNormal>Subject: Re: [Physics] Situation of the calculation of alpha (the fine</p><p class=MsoNormal> structure constant)</p><p class=MsoNormal>Message-ID:</p><p class=MsoNormal> <CAPmfgRzQkyxNCdd+F49RF9DnPSEzUnyXC6C9P4KdH70tK+ef6Q@mail.gmail.com></p><p class=MsoNormal>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Hello Jesus,</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Please consider my comments on your speculative thoughts.</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Mathematical Approach:</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>In my opinion , Quadratic Equations are too simplistic to accurately</p><p class=MsoNormal>represent the physical reality. Possibly quadratic equation could represent</p><p class=MsoNormal>some approximation , where higher order terms of a binomial expansion have</p><p class=MsoNormal>negligible contribution. However, I don't know how this may help or apply</p><p class=MsoNormal>to your case. May be the error is due to neglecting higher order terms.</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Physical Approach:</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Sea gull around light house analogy is interesting. But I realized that</p><p class=MsoNormal>every particle have spins, so absolute non rotating lighthouses should</p><p class=MsoNormal>not exist. Infact all particles are seagull with internal (of mirror) and</p><p class=MsoNormal>external (about a point outside itself) spins.</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Additional Comment</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Is not alpha times c, approximately equal to velocity of sun about the</p><p class=MsoNormal>Galactic centre? As the sun moves, all particles that we can measure move</p><p class=MsoNormal>along.Alpha times c is also equal to velocity of electron in first Bohr</p><p class=MsoNormal>orbit of hydrogen atom.</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Regards,</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Tufail Abbas</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>On 29 Jan 2018 12:06 am, "Jesus Sanchez" <jesus.sanchez.bilbao@gmail.com></p><p class=MsoNormal>wrote:</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Dear all,</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>I have been trying during the last year to find an alternative way to</p><p class=MsoNormal>arrive to the value of the constant alpha 0.00729 (unitless constant). I</p><p class=MsoNormal>have updated the situation of the project in researchgate and I attach it</p><p class=MsoNormal>to you for your information.</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Hello all,</p><p class=MsoNormal>I will explain here all that I have tried, but regretfully with no the</p><p class=MsoNormal>expected results. But just in case this experience can be usefull for all</p><p class=MsoNormal>of you or the next ones to come.</p><p class=MsoNormal>-First: mathematical approach. Forgetting about the meaning, I have looked</p><p class=MsoNormal>for new numbers (apart from pi and the powers of two) inside the sine wave</p><p class=MsoNormal>and the sphere (where the electron is moving). For example, I have found</p><p class=MsoNormal>the length of the elementary sine wave in a cycle to be 7.640... (a number</p><p class=MsoNormal>obtained with an integration and not related to pi). So I have tried to</p><p class=MsoNormal>correlate with fine structure constant with no result. I have found a lot</p><p class=MsoNormal>of new numbers if we project the sine wave in the sphere (the real length</p><p class=MsoNormal>of the elctron trajectory). I have mixed all these new numbers among them,</p><p class=MsoNormal>with pi, powers of two. Whatever you can imagine with no result.</p><p class=MsoNormal>-Second: Physical approach. For this what I have defined is a model where</p><p class=MsoNormal>the proton is like a lighthouse and the electron is like a seagull with a</p><p class=MsoNormal>rotating mirror in his head. Trying to fix that it is necessary that at</p><p class=MsoNormal>certain points both things must face each other so the photons can be sent</p><p class=MsoNormal>and abosrbed by the electron. Let's say like a discretization of</p><p class=MsoNormal>interactions (not alll possible, only the ones that fulfill certain</p><p class=MsoNormal>timing/synchronization). Also, taking into account that as the electron is</p><p class=MsoNormal>moving, the mirror rotates slower than the proton because of relativistic</p><p class=MsoNormal>issues (even if we consider that originally rotated at the same speed), so</p><p class=MsoNormal>the synchro has to be got via distances or angles. This would lead to</p><p class=MsoNormal>constraints, and the fine structure constant would appear as one of them.</p><p class=MsoNormal>Believe me I have tried. Normally I would get a promising quartic equation</p><p class=MsoNormal>with two complex roots (disregarded in principle) a trivial value like zero</p><p class=MsoNormal>or higher than one (higher than the speed of light) and the final root, the</p><p class=MsoNormal>value that should be alpha=0.00729, it is normally a value betwenn 0,2 and</p><p class=MsoNormal>0,5 far away from alpha.</p><p class=MsoNormal>Also, I have tried to considerate that these particles have spin 1/2 so an</p><p class=MsoNormal>own turn is 4pi instead of 2pi, making variations in the result but</p><p class=MsoNormal>continueing being far away from alpha.</p><p class=MsoNormal>The nearest I have been to alpha is 1/16pi^2 (0.00633). It is logical as it</p><p class=MsoNormal>is 1/(4pi)^2 being 4pi one own turn for an electron. And the squares are</p><p class=MsoNormal>easy to get when there are relatvistic issues or quartic equations. And the</p><p class=MsoNormal>rest for the fine tuning (until 0.00729) would be with the rest of the</p><p class=MsoNormal>coefficients of whatever the equation it is.</p><p class=MsoNormal>Sorry to give bad news but this is the situation, I will keep trying if I</p><p class=MsoNormal>have more ideas or ways to follow. But the pace would be even slower than</p><p class=MsoNormal>until now.</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>https://www.researchgate.net/project/Calculation-of-the-</p><p class=MsoNormal>fine-structure-constant</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>_______________________________________________</p><p class=MsoNormal>Physics mailing list</p><p class=MsoNormal>Physics@tuks.nl</p><p class=MsoNormal>http://mail.tuks.nl/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/physics</p><p class=MsoNormal>-------------- next part --------------</p><p class=MsoNormal>An HTML attachment was scrubbed...</p><p class=MsoNormal>URL: <http://mail.tuks.nl/pipermail/physics/attachments/20180130/23cc2789/attachment-0001.html></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>------------------------------</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Message: 2</p><p class=MsoNormal>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2018 16:15:07 -0500</p><p class=MsoNormal>From: Soretna <illumination00@gmail.com></p><p class=MsoNormal>To: General Physics and Natural Philosophy <physics@tuks.nl></p><p class=MsoNormal>Subject: [Physics] Pari Spolter: Gravitational Force of the Sun & The</p><p class=MsoNormal> Dance of the Moon</p><p class=MsoNormal>Message-ID:</p><p class=MsoNormal> <CAH9N7PVJs7RKXnn8KC2Bce3FpSP9VskqQSXpxWkEas-id2VW3g@mail.gmail.com></p><p class=MsoNormal>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Has anyone closely reviewed the works of Dr. Pari Spolter? She has decades</p><p class=MsoNormal>of effort in her calculations and the work appears quite promising in</p><p class=MsoNormal>shedding light on a lot of questions from the past few hundred years. Her</p><p class=MsoNormal>research efforts on Einstein alone are gold and well worth the investment</p><p class=MsoNormal>in reading her works, but the actual bulk of her effort seems to be</p><p class=MsoNormal>extremely illuminating. Was curious if anyone else had some remarks and</p><p class=MsoNormal>insights from her works.</p><p class=MsoNormal>-------------- next part --------------</p><p class=MsoNormal>An HTML attachment was scrubbed...</p><p class=MsoNormal>URL: <http://mail.tuks.nl/pipermail/physics/attachments/20180130/76ce0ca0/attachment-0001.html></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>------------------------------</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Subject: Digest Footer</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>_______________________________________________</p><p class=MsoNormal>Physics mailing list</p><p class=MsoNormal>Physics@tuks.nl</p><p class=MsoNormal>http://mail.tuks.nl/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/physics</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>------------------------------</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>End of Physics Digest, Vol 11, Issue 4</p><p class=MsoNormal>**************************************</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div></body></html>