[Physics] Gravitational Time Dilation and Gravitational Redshift - two separate things?

[carmam at tiscali.co.uk]

Doug, you must specify what type of clock you are using. In a larger/more intense gravitation field, an atomic clock slows down and a pendulum clock speeds up. In a smaller/less intense field, the opposite happens. The gravitational redshift of light theory is wrong, as shown in this web page http://www.extinctionshift.com/ by Henry Dowdye.
Tom Hollings



----Original Message----

From: dm88dm at gmail.com

Date: 04/12/2018 21:12 

To: "General Physics and Natural Philosophy discussion list"<physics at tuks.nl>

Subj: [Physics] Gravitational Time Dilation and Gravitational Redshift -	two separate things?



Hi All,
    This just came up in a question I had to my website - it has to do with the Pound-Rebka experiment and whether gravitational time dilation of clocks and gravitational redshift of EM are two different things or the same thing. The problem is set out by L.B. Okun is plain language in an article here: https://arxiv.org/pdf/hep-ph/0010256.pdf   The essence of it is that if you take a clock and move it from the ground to the top of a tower, the clock should speed up in it's rate at the higher altitude. If you then send an EM signal from this clock back to the ground, Einstein says that the EM should be blue-shifted. However, this would mean that the signal sent to the ground has now been blue-shifted TWICE, once due to the clock speeding up,  and once due to the fall of the EM through the gravitational gradient. 
However, the Pound-Rebka experiment finds that it is blue-shifted only once. So which effect is redundant, gravitational time dilation of clocks or gravitational red-shift of light? They can't be the same thing, since the latter is an operation performed on the EM during transit, and is supposed to make it bend. And the former is something which happens to clocks independent of EM signals sent between them. 
Interestingly, the experiment proposed by Okun to answer the question was performed in a slightly different form by Tom Van Baak as described here: 


http://leapsecond.com/great2005/
Another link that is useful is the paper here which examines the math used in the Pound-Rebka experiment and finds it is full of errors! 

http://milesmathis.com/pound.html
Just wondering if anyone else is aware of this apparent contradiction in the relativistic thinking : ) 

Doug




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